PayPal via Authorize.Net???

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PayPal via Authorize.Net???

Postby bugman » Thu Oct 05, 2017 11:22 am

Does anyone have any experience using Authorize.Net to process PayPal payments (https://www.authorize.net/solutions/merchantsolutions/merchantservices/paypal/)?

On one of my two websites, we have MANY customers that pay with funds from their Paypal accounts (and currently we also use Paypal rather than A.Net to process credit card transactions - so only one gateway to manage).

I have ongoing issues with that site not getting the IPN (Instant Payment Notification) back from Paypal (and I cannot release the goods until I know payment has been completed). (SIDEBAR - the issue here is that my hosting provider's firewall blocks communications from unknown IP addresses, and unfortunately the IPN's from Paypal often come back from unknown IP's (Paypal uses a 3rd party provider (Akamai) to handle these communications, and the IP's constantly change.))

So... I'm wondering if switching to using the Authorize.Net gateway in Able to handle Paypal payments could help.

A complication is that the bean counter in my business (aka my wife!), really prefers several things about Paypal vs A.Net (I have another website that uses A.Net for credit cards, so she routinely handles payments from both companies, and she finds the reporting/accounting much easier with Paypal than with A.Net).

So, I'm wondering if it's possible to get A.Net to handle the communications... can A.Net get the IPN back from Paypal and then A.Net send that info to my site?

In the "Digital Payment Solutions" section of my A.Net account, it says I can enable Paypal payments so that I "grant Authorize.Net permission to submit transactions (to Paypal) on your behalf".

OK... so this sounds like A.Net would be a "middle man" between my site and Paypal?

Would that mean that when a customer chooses to pay with Paypal, first my site tells A.Net that customer is going to use Paypal, then A.Net "monitors" the payment transaction, and when Paypal sends out the "payment complete" message (the elusive IPN), that A.Net would grab that, and then A.Net (rather than Paypal) could tell my site that payment was complete?

If the payment is actually coming out of a person's Paypal account balance, I know PP will obviously have to handle that, so the transaction records will be in my Paypal account, right?

And could it be configured so that CREDIT CARD payments -are still actually "processed" by Paypal (not A.Net) so they are still deposited in my Paypal account?

My wife's main preference with PP over A.Net is that A.Net forces a batch close daily, which results in 30 deposits per month into our bank account (tedious reconciliation), whereas with PAYPAL, the money from ea transaction just accumulates in our PP account, and she can sweep once a week which makes her accounting work easier.

So... if granting A.Net permission to "submit transactions on my behalf" merely means they will handle the communications (and Paypal will still handle the FUNDS), this might work.

Any thoughts are greatly appreciated!!!
Thanks!

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Re: PayPal via Authorize.Net???

Postby Katie » Fri Oct 06, 2017 8:41 am

A complication is that the bean counter in my business (aka my wife!), really prefers several things about Paypal vs A.Net (I have another website that uses A.Net for credit cards, so she routinely handles payments from both companies, and she finds the reporting/accounting much easier with Paypal than with A.Net).


We recently moved away from Authorize.net because of the terrible reports and excess monthly fees. I suggest that you keep using Paypal and incorporate Website Payments Pro (Visa/MC/Amx) with Express Checkout. So all payments are coming into one place. Plus PayPal has a flat monthly fee.

I don't have any knowledge about Authorize.net supporting Paypal. Sounds interesting, but I don't know if it would work with AbleCommerce.

Hope this helps a little
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Re: PayPal via Authorize.Net???

Postby bugman » Sun Oct 08, 2017 2:25 am

We recently moved away from Authorize.net because of the terrible reports and excess monthly fees.


Does that mean Ablecommerce will not support the A.Net gateway going forward??

Here is the info from A.Net about this: https://www.authorize.net/solutions/merchantsolutions/merchantservices/paypal/.
Thanks!

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Re: PayPal via Authorize.Net???

Postby Katie » Sun Oct 08, 2017 7:21 am

I think you misunderstood. We used Anet internally and switched to PayPal.

Anet is the most popular gateway, so of course we plan to always support it.

Thanks
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Re: PayPal via Authorize.Net???

Postby bugman » Mon Oct 09, 2017 3:38 am

AH, gotcha.

(Also, I sent you an email a few days ago, did you get that?)

Thanks Katie.
Thanks!

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Re: PayPal via Authorize.Net???

Postby AbleMods » Fri Oct 13, 2017 2:35 am

AuthNet doesn't support talking to PayPal.

I agree with Katie's suggestion - switching to Website Payments Pro would be your best route. Everything then runs through PayPal and your boss is happy. Which means you'll be happy. Because when she's NOT happy...well you get the idea :;

Me personally, I would challenge your hosting provider about blocking traffic from "unknown" IP addresses. I would never do that in my hosting business. Unknown IP addresses are no more or less secure than known ones. I am just as concerned with traffic from known IP blocks such as Amazon AWS or Microsoft Azure....they attack my systems just as often, if not more, than foreign/unknown IP addresses.

IP block assignments change all the time. Your provider could very well be blocking legit traffic and that easily will affect website sales.
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Re: PayPal via Authorize.Net???

Postby bugman » Mon Oct 16, 2017 10:32 am

Joe,

Thanks for weighing in.

Apparently Auth.Net DOES support communicating with Paypal in some fashion (https://www.authorize.net/solutions/merchantsolutions/merchantservices/paypal/), but it looks like it's only Paypal Express Checkout - not Paypal Standard.

Isn't "Paypal Websites Payments Pro" the gateway that Ablecommerce provides in the Able backend named "Paypal Payflow Pro"? I do have that implemented - that's what we use to process credit cards on the site I'm asking about, and that works great, it's just the IPN failures we have that are continually an issue (and I'm pretty sure all the IPN failures are from payments made from Paypal account funds - not credit cards processed thru the PP gateway), and that "Paypal Payflow Pro" gateway does not list "Paypal" (meaning Paypal account balance funds) as a payment method that can be used with it - it only lists the credit cards.

The IPN failures are A ROYAL PITA if I am to be blunt!! :-O

I will definitely have that "why do you have to block unknown IP's?" discussion with my hosting provider, thanks for that suggestion.

(And also, I am going to send you a PM - please be on the lookout for that!)
Thanks!

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Re: PayPal via Authorize.Net???

Postby AbleMods » Mon Oct 16, 2017 2:38 pm

bugman wrote:Apparently Auth.Net DOES support communicating with Paypal in some fashion (https://www.authorize.net/solutions/mer ... es/paypal/), but it looks like it's only Paypal Express Checkout - not Paypal Standard.


Interesting. My apologies, I didn't realize such an integration existed. And it's been around for years, which surprises me that I have never seen (or heard of) it.

I've read over the API for it. It seems odd how they've implemented it. It appears to be a three-step process:

First, you call AuthNet's PayPal API with your "intent" to charge a PayPal account. That returns a secure PayPal URL.
Second, you present that secure URL (presumably in some sort of popup) to the shopper so they can authenticate PayPal itself. The shopper then approves the transaction.
Third, a second call is made to AuthNet's PayPal API to perform the actual capture. So you can't just 'charge' a PayPal address. Which, if you think about it, is probably a good thing :)

Overall it would seem an awkward implementation for Able. Or any eCommerce system I'd imagine. So many potential points of failure. Error-handling would have to be extensive, lest the shopper get lost in a sea of popups or browser-back clicks that ruin the postback state. The potential benefit of having two different payment systems consolidated on a unified settlement report is appealing. But it sure seems like a lot of work re-engineering an otherwise-solid checkout process for just that one benefit.

So while it would gain your better-half the benefit she wants, it doesn't seem practical (to me) in anything other than a pure-paypal-custom-one-trick-pony ecommerce system.

I can remember IPN being unreliable 7 years ago. It sucks because your platform (Able) is completely dependent on PayPal doing their job properly. And when they don't do it properly, the IPN never arrives or arrives malformed and you (the admin) just get frustrated. Over. And over. And over again.

bugman wrote:Isn't "Paypal Websites Payments Pro" the gateway that Ablecommerce provides in the Able backend named "Paypal Payflow Pro"?


I don't recall exactly, but I believe Payflow Pro is different. As I recall, there are three 'flavors' of PayPal transaction processing:

Express Checkout: Shopper goes straight to PayPal, logs in with a PayPal ID (or optionally chooses credit card) and pays inside PayPal. This is enabled by just specifying the merchant PayPal ID on the PayPal gateway setup.

Website Payments Pro: This allows your Able store to use PayPal as a card processor as well as accept PayPal payments. This is similar to AuthNet. Card details are sent to PayPal, PayPal responds in realtime with 'Authorized', 'Captured', 'Declined' etc. Super similar to how AuthNet works. Except PayPal is your processor, your gateway AND your bank account. The money stays at PayPal.

Payflow Pro: Same as Payments Pro, except you can choose your processor and choose your bank. PayPal is simply your gateway. Money goes into your bank, not sitting in PayPal. This is the closest to how AuthNet works.
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Re: PayPal via Authorize.Net???

Postby bugman » Tue Oct 17, 2017 4:36 am

Thanks for all that Joe, it does help me understand a little better. I still need to do some more reading to really get my brain around the differences, but what you have supplied does help - thank you very much.

And your comments about Paypal-over-A.net likely adding complexity does make me wary, I agree that it sounds like the potential problems might outweigh the benefits. I'd like to REDUCE complexity, not add more of it!

And add to that the fact that Katie said she, too was not familiar with it, so... to me that suggests Able might not be adequately coded to properly handle it.

Thanks again for your comments.
Thanks!

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Re: PayPal via Authorize.Net???

Postby Katie » Thu Oct 19, 2017 6:19 am

We have integrated with Paypal's Braintree payment gateway which can be used for credit card payments as well as being a replacement for Paypal std (no more unreliable IPN). There is a patch available for Gold R12 SR1, and it will also be available in the next release of Gold.

http://help.ablecommerce.com/mergedProj ... intree.htm
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Re: PayPal via Authorize.Net???

Postby bugman » Thu Oct 19, 2017 10:20 am

Good to know - thank you Katie!!
Thanks!

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Re: PayPal via Authorize.Net???

Postby foodsleuth » Mon Oct 30, 2017 7:50 am

Katie wrote:We have integrated with Paypal's Braintree payment gateway which can be used for credit card payments as well as being a replacement for Paypal std (no more unreliable IPN). There is a patch available for Gold R12 SR1, and it will also be available in the next release of Gold.

http://help.ablecommerce.com/mergedProj ... intree.htm


Hi,
When will that patch be released?

Thanks
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Re: PayPal via Authorize.Net???

Postby foodsleuth » Mon Oct 30, 2017 7:52 am

OOOOH I reread that, so there is a patch available now? How do I get that?

Thanks!!!
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Re: PayPal via Authorize.Net???

Postby Katie » Mon Oct 30, 2017 8:09 am

Hi Barb,

http://help.ablecommerce.com/mergedProj ... intree.htm

The download is available from the linked document. We'll have Gold R12 SR2 available very soon, which will have Braintree with a few other bug fixes.

Thanks
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